Change for sake of change?

by Redneck Wed 3 Jun - 12:55:55

The winning medley / MSR.

Would / should a band with a proven winning set of tunes change their tunes just for the sake of it, or should it be played until someone displaces the band?.

My thoughts are if it ain't broke don't fix it, but, there's the chance of staleness creeping in to players mentality of " Och we know this stuff no need to practise at home " setting in. Bad habits through lack of practise will evidently creep in.

So, would it be better to tweak rather than a full scale change?

We have beefed up our MSR, learnt Hugh Kennedy, kept the same S,R. This change IMO was for the better, not just for the sake of it, but more to improve our musical content in the MSR.

Two jigs remain from our prize winning performances in 2007. Complete overhaul of the Medley, again IMO for the same reasons as above.

This years tunes will be next seasons sets.

Some feedback please.

Pint

by Dai Robb Wed 3 Jun - 13:00:01

If I can add my pennyworth, I agree to a point Iain about why mend whats not broken, BUT you (I think) gave the answer yourself, would not staleness creep in and spread?. We have all moaned at some point about being asked to play the same old tunes, AG, SWH, HC etc, would this not be the same thing? only occurrring in a competition could be a disaster waiting to happen.
However if it has been successful for the band over a period, why not as you say, just make the odd tweak here and there to keep the players on their toes/

by Gordy88 Wed 3 Jun - 14:46:39

I reckon a bit of both is needed,

Foe example, do you concentrate on The green Hills as much as youur MSR,

You should, but i'll bet you don't, even on a subconsious level.

There is a case for continuity, but to be honest, playing the same stuff over and over gets stale for me, by the end of a season, i'm sick looking at the competition pieces,

A lot will depend on the band, but IMO it does take the second season to really nail a medley, so I would have a spare sitting ready for next year, and take the best out of the other 2.

That would mean having two spot medleys and one on the back burner

With MSR's, I would be inclined to change 1 tune in each per year.

In grade 1, that means learning about 10 tunes, and if you think you're a grade1 player and can't do that, you should stay at home and knit socks

Evolution rather than revolution is the way.

cheers

by Redneck Wed 3 Jun - 16:59:18

Dai Robb wrote:If I can add my pennyworth, I agree to a point Iain about why mend whats not broken, BUT you (I think) gave the answer yourself, would not staleness creep in and spread?.

Yes indeed, but the FMM were ridiculed for their highly successful Fiddlers Rally medley, if I'm not mistaken RP resurrected this and tho 'n behold...wack, they won.

So is change really needed?.

@Gordy, some good points there m8 'n would tend to agree.

by Dai Robb Wed 3 Jun - 17:02:40

I also said though that rather than allow Staleness to creep in, a little tweak here and there could rejuvinate things

by Redneck Wed 3 Jun - 18:33:28

Dai Robb wrote:I also said though that rather than allow Staleness to creep in, a little tweak here and there could rejuvinate things

True, but they didn't tweak..........they played the complete old winning medley.

by True_Blue_Piper Thu 4 Jun - 10:57:20

I agree with Gordy. A little bit of both.

If you play the same stuff over and over again, you eventually get bored with it, indeed.....even sick of it, and if that happens, the standards can drop.

Sometimes, just to keep the interest and the standards up, change is a good thing.

But to change for change's sake.....no.

If ain't broke, don't fix it.

by Dai Robb Thu 4 Jun - 12:59:24

Redneck wrote:
Dai Robb wrote:I also said though that rather than allow Staleness to creep in, a little tweak here and there could rejuvinate things

True, but they didn't tweak..........they played the complete old winning medley.

You got me wrong there Iain, what I was trying to say(the brain goes as you get older doesnt it Iain?)
WAS, by all means keep the tunes that are successful etc, but perhaps a little tweak here and there would keep the interest going, I was not saying that is what FMM did(At least i dont think I meant to say that?) laughing

gets complicated this Cyber chat doesnt it? just confirms what i have said elsewhere this morning?

by wee_fee-Fee Fri 5 Jun - 10:32:09

This seems like a very interesting topic. Well done Iain.

If after playing the same medley / msr you decide that, as much as you loved the music, it has gone as far as it could go - the more you play it did not gain any more momentum than the last and you were not getting the places you were hoping for then I think that is when it is time to change. Take a rock band for instance... bands decide to disappear for a little while, write, record and re-invent themselves. The original members remain there, the ideologies remain, the sound shifted only slightly, if not a little more catchy you are treated as a whole new band. If you are wanting to drastically change your bands medley you need to handle it well with respect to the members who will actually be playing the tunes and with a very specific point in mind of how your new material will be portrayed and how the credibility of the band will be handled. You spend a lot of time with the guys in the band so the pipe major and lead tip should be clear what their expectations of the band are. If you are having issues with your tune choice you still don't need to change the whole medley... Look at the crits through out the year which tunes are the judges commenting on. Perhaps changing part of the melody will work. Or you could keep a tune and tweak it with harmonies. You could also try your luck at composing songs, and if you compose songs that wow the crowd, then you are playing something that is unique and enjoyable. I always say keep some traditional stuff in it so that the audience and judge can relate to what you are playing. Take Toronto Police medley from last year not that I want to single them out in anyway but for me it was very technical and I didn't know where a tune started and finished. But they went out their and tried something different and I respect them for that. I also say there is more to a medley than knowing the scores and tunes that is simply not enough. The band needs to be able to perform it, make it their own and add a little of "themselves" to make it your own unique style.

Maybe I have drifted a little off topic here but I think it is all part of being a successful band. Preparing a set list of tunes is perhaps the most important decision the band will make. Every band member should have a say in the bands final set list providing the Pipe Major and Lead Tip can properly "sell" the tune. If they are uncomfortable with any tune, scratch the tune off the set list. The music on the set list should be varied. If you start with a high energy hornpipe, throw in a little variety to mix with your audience. Give them a break and slow the pace down once in a while unless high energy is what you want from beginning to end! You need to remember your timescale is limited so in that time pick tunes to impress the judges and the audience. I wouldn’t go changing for the sake of changing unless cracks are rising.

by Redneck Fri 5 Jun - 12:27:00

Good stuff Fiona, good example and as usual, some very good points.

The selection of tunes must be embedded in each members head to the extent they are not thinking / worrying about a certain phrase coming up.
This is where I think the familiararity comes into it's own, staleness will and can be overcome in the bandroom. To have a good medley / MSR is a good thing, I think our MSR is good enough to carry into grade 2. So no need for change IMO, barr learning a second one lol.

This years medley will also do us next year, when, I feel it will blossom. ( more technical than previous one ) Time for the comfort zone to set in and let the music be played freely and expressed without undue worry.

by Dai Robb Fri 5 Jun - 12:59:05

Well said Fiona and well presented, Just as a matter of interest picking up on what Fiona has said about The PM and Lead Tip "selling" tunes to the band, and every Band member having an "input" i wonder how many Bands actually do this?
Maybe my memory is letting me down, but i cant ever remember being asked for any input in my day, I dont know is this common practice/

by wee_fee-Fee Fri 5 Jun - 13:10:59

We are very much a unit when it comes to tune choices. Guys bring up tunes they like, suggest tunes, compose tunes and it is then up to our PM whether he wants to take that any further. Our PM will bring tunes to band dish them out and asks for opinions. But if somebody doesn’t like something then our PM and Lead Tip are very approachable and take all your comments on board even to the extent of changing things to benefit the band as a whole. As regards the bass section everyone has an input. If someone would like something put in, that adds something to the performance and everyone is capable of it we try out best to incorporate that somewhere in the score.

by Dai Robb Fri 5 Jun - 13:36:29

Thanks for that, obviously I should imagine that sort of "togetherness" perhaps would show in the Band performance in the circle. As I said i cant remember anything like that in my day? BUt I could be wrong

by Redneck Fri 5 Jun - 16:28:02

We are the same Fiona, at the end of the day all PM's will have the final say.
The 'Lough are a none tyrant band,no slabberin' or spoutin either, one big ( small ) happy outfit. Very open and adventurous in their ideas.( and drinking habits )